New Telegraph

Nigerians know they were lied to in 2015 – Kukah

Bishop Matthew Kukah

…urges electorate to vote right leaders in 2023

Bishop Matthew Hassan Kukah, the current Bishop of the Roman Catholic Diocese of Sokoto State, has reiterated the need for justice in Nigeria to give room for an egalitarian society. Kukah, who was a guest on Arise Television’s Morning Show on Friday, took a swipe at the Federal Government over the level of insecurity in the nation, but expressed hope that the Independent National Electoral Commission (INEC) would conduct credible General Elections in 2023. The interview was monitored by OLADIPUPO AWOJOBI. Excerpts:

You wrote a book called; “Witness To Justice,” which I adore so much and I have read it over and over again, but let us look at what happened in Sokoto State where you are based, the Police are saying that the people arrested over the death of Deborah Samuel are not the true killers, that they are still looking for the suspects, what it means that Deborah has died in vain, and there is injustice everywhere, what would you have to say about that?

As a priest, a lot of my critics say that ‘you should be blessing us rather than confronting the government.’ But I told them that my responsibility as a priest is to comfort those who are victims of injustice. The Bible encourages us to comfort the afflicted, but I also argue that we have a duty as priests to afflict the comfortable. It is a contradiction that stares us in the face. To start with, Deborah Samuel didn’t die in vain, the first thing to say about the death of Deborah is that no Christian, who dies witnessing for Christ should die in vain. She is just like Leah Sharibu and other young people that have suffered or died for defending their faith. I said that the system we are practicing is a combination of theocracy and feudalism, it is a system that is so complex and convoluted and it cannot pass the test of democracy. On Deborah Samuel, the Sultan of Sokoto spoke, the Sokoto State Governor spoke and I also added my voice. And in each of the interventions, we called for justice. The next stage was that we called for the trial of these people and a group of people said that this trial cannot take place, and what has been done is to keep to the principle of wisdom. There are millions of Muslims, who are ambivalent about all of these. The only answer to that question is we are not really a theocratic state, so Nigeria cannot be governed on the principle of any religion. The real test of any government, according to the constitution is the consideration to the extent the constitution is a mirror by which every citizen, no matter who you are, has to rate himself or herself, do you pass this test? But here we have a president that did not say anything about the killing of Deborah Samuel, compare that with President Joe Biden of the United States of America kneeling in front of George Floyd’s son saying ‘I’m apologising because America failed you.’ The revolt against the church after we condemned the killing of Deborah Samuel was much; they destroyed our windows, they destroyed the cathedral, it’s just that we are lucky that some of our youths were able to repel them before the police arrived. They went to our pastoral centre and destroyed beds, and vehicles, they went to one of our churches and burnt part of it down. This is the only country, where people kill you in the name of religion whether you are a Christian or Muslim and the Federal Government or the state has nothing to say or do about it. You rebuild your church or mosque on your own and we are supposed to be in a country. The challenge for us is that there are certain distortions in the constitution and there is nobody to make all these things very clear. We have a National Assembly that does not understand what we must do to ensure justice in the country. So, injustice persists and it will continue because we are just pretending that we have a democracy. Our democracy has not been tested and allowed to function. This is the only country, where you can kill 50, 60 or 100 people and nobody cares. So, really, you can see that we asking the people to vote, but many Nigerians are entitled to ask; “vote for what and for whom? We do not need to have a democracy where there is no justice for all, and Nigeria is such an unequal society, it’s an unjust and an unfair society. This is why we will continue to confront this bastion of injustice because until there is justice for everyone there can never be justice for anyone.

What is your take on the emerging political process in the country because recently, a national newspaper did an analysis on how the 2023 General Elections will go and narrowed it down to the All Progressives Congress (APC), Peoples Democratic Party (PDP) and the Labour Party with the presidential candidate of the New Nigeria Peoples Party (NNPP), Dr. Rabiu Musa Kwakwanso, receiving notable mention in the analysis? What do you think of the process, can the campaign start on September 28, what dangers do you think we should watch out for and what do you think of these frontline candidates?

First of all, my conviction is that if these are the people that the parties have thrown up, each and every one of them is qualified to be the President of Nigeria. It is left for Nigerians to choose who they want. This is one election that I feel very hopeful about and here I must commend the President for what he has done to take the Independent National Electoral Commission (INEC) to the level he has taken it to along with the National Assembly. On the process, there is a need for us to be hopeful that despite the savages that have characterised the Nigerian political scene, we were still able to get here. We are coming to a point that is very close to the extent that what you put in is what you are likely to get out. So, to that extent, INEC has given us some hope. Also, the energy in this election is tremendous, I am even excited and confident about the incredible amount of knowledge and passion that the young people have in the process. I know many young people, who have options of going somewhere that have decided to stay here and fight. Those of us who have alternative addresses must reject them. We must know that this is our country; we are not going to outsource our obligations and responsibilities. Unfortunately, this is a coast to a high election process in which the fabrics of our society is literarily in shreds and to curb all these, bringing confidence, thinking of how to secure the country and giving the people enough confidence to go out to vote are what would be the challenge. So, I believe that this government has tried in many respects, but the area I would continue to knock this government consistently is in the area of human security. We have to be physically alive, but this government has done very little to put human security in the front burner. That has been my greatest disappointment. But I believe that Nigerians are energised, they have the ability to make their choices, and we must stop these politicians in their tracks. I must commend the media for confronting these politicians. We must create an opportunity for ordinary people to ask questions that worry them. We need to insist on having a sense of confidence. Everybody wants to look at this country as a mirror and what is in it for him or her. People believe that the only thing in this country is that we go out there to vote and they go there to enjoy. The bane of this election is the anger and the frustration of young people. The only responsibility that we have is to channel this anger appropriately and get the right outcome.

How do you see young people shaping these elections and what do you see young Nigerians doing ahead of these elections?

I followed the Kenyan elections closely and what I found interesting were the knowledge and capacity of many young people and young commentators. As I say, if you listen to these young people, you would see that what many of them are accomplishing within 20 years are things that many of us that are old now never accomplished in our first 50 years. The point is that elections are not the destinations. The destination is to get Nigeria to greatness and it is not a generational thing. What I’m saying is that we are happy that technology has enabled this generation. Despite the convoluted nature of Nigeria, many young people have been able to rise and excel. One of the things that took place in my 70th birthday celebration, which the media did not capture, was to get some young people to compete on ICT and so on. Three categories of prizes were given out and you would be amazed at the kind of things young people were doing. One of the things some politicians would ignore at their own risk is the assumption that somehow all the people in Northern Nigeria feel the same. The passion that drove people in 2015 have been dissipated because people realised that they were lied to. We have seen many Northern clerics, who said that they deceived their people by saying that 2015 election was a Jihad. Now, we have seen the consequences of religious manipulation. Those who used ethnicity have now paid the price. Beyond the thousands of people that have lost their lives, one positive thing we have learnt in the last seven years is that anybody with a sense of discernment will appreciate that you should not vote for any candidate because he tells you that he is going to establish an Islamic State or he is going to favour Christians. That should be a sign that this is the worst any politician can say to you and I see that young people are becoming aware of that. I know thousands of farmers, who have changed their perception about what Nigeria is and they have an idea about who they can trust. I am amazed to hear a Northerner on the radio saying something nostalgic about former President Jonathan’s policy on Almjari. Despite not being a Muslim, Jonathan values education so much that he spent billions of naira building Almajiri schools. Ordinary Nigerians, whether Christians or Muslims, are aware of what is going on, so the politicians should go to every nook and cranny of the country and sell their convictions.

At, 70 what are the things that keep you going and do you have any regret, we also want you to talk to us about Kukah Centre, would that be your gift for public discourse in Nigeria?

First of all, I would have said I have no regret, but the only regret I have and what gives me sleepless nights within and outside Nigeria and makes me sad is to see how a nation of such incredible human beings with great capacity has been taken over by marauders, people lacking the passion and commitment to place this country, where it ought to be. That’s my greatest regret in Nigeria. What gave me urgency about putting the Kukah Centre together is that I consider myself as a public intellectual and this country has been extraordinarily gracious to me. If you ask me where I get my energy from, it is from the streets of Nigeria, the ordinary people I see on the streets, whether Christian or Muslim. With a sense of modesty, I have given out a little bit of scholarship awards in the last few years of my being a Christian, focusing on things that can change the lives of the people. There are opportunities out there. The idea of the Kukah Centre came from my experience at the Kennedy School in Harvard University, United States of America. My classmate in Harvard is the waiting Prime Minister in Singapore. What I learnt in Harvard is that governance can be taught, it can be learned, and it is about story telling. My argument is that it is not everybody that gets to power that has the knowledge. Intellectual contributions are the most important things that we need. My idea is that people can come from everywhere to the centre to learn about governance.

Quoting Section 92 of Electoral Act 2022, INEC recently warned churches and mosques against political campaigns for the 2023 General Elections, what do you say to that, INEC even said it’s an offence?

This ignorant attempt to dichotomise between church and state is as if the people who go to churches are not the Reuben Abatis. It is the same people that go to churches that go to mosques; the physical church is just a structure. There is a law and if you run foul of the law, you should be punished. For instance, there is a law against murder, whoever commits murder should be punished. If, for instance crude oil is kept in my church and mosques, then which are just churches and mosques? If crude oil is found in my church take me out and try me. INEC cannot tell me that we should encourage our people to vote and get their PVCs, but then say something else. I won’t campaign for anybody, because that’s not my job but if you now talk about people allowing politicians to use their mosques and churches to campaign, a lot of people will be offended by that attitude.

Please follow and like us:

Read Previous

FG assures of plans to reposition Onne Port

Read Next

Osinbajo proposes debt for climate swap deal in US

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *